Legislature(2017 - 2018)GRUENBERG 120
03/28/2017 05:30 PM House STATE AFFAIRS
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB13 | |
| HB163 | |
| HB190 | |
| HB181 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| += | HB 163 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 181 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 190 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| += | HB 13 | TELECONFERENCED | |
HB 181-LEGISLATURE PER DIEM AND TRAVEL ALLOWANCE
6:04:30 PM
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS announced that the final order of business
would be HOUSE BILL NO. 181, "An Act relating to per diem for
legislators; relating to a travel allowance for legislators and
legislative employees; and relating to the State Officers
Compensation Commission."
6:04:44 PM
The committee took an at-ease from 6:04 p.m. to 6:07 p.m.
6:07:06 PM
BERETT WILBER, Staff, Representative Jonathan Kreiss-Tomkins,
Alaska State Legislature, presented HB 181 on behalf of
Representative Kreiss-Tomkins, prime sponsor, with the use of a
PowerPoint presentation. She began by referring to Slide 2,
entitled "What's the point of HB 181?" She stated that the
intent of HB 181 is to empower the State Officers Compensation
Commission (SOCC) to set legislative per diem.
MS. WILBER referred to Slide 3, entitled "How does per diem
currently work?" She relayed that legislative per diem is money
paid to legislators to cover lodging, meals, and incidental
expenses related to legislators' work during the legislative
session. It is automatically paid to a legislator unless he/she
contacts the Legislative Affairs Agency (LAA) and declines
payment, which may be done on a daily basis. She added that the
current per diem policy for Alaska legislators has been set by
the Legislative Council Joint Committee (Legislative Council)
since 1993. She explained that the current policy is that the
legislative per diem is equal to the highest rate of federal per
diem for the location of session.
6:08:29 PM
MS. WILBER referred to Slide 4, entitled "What does the highest
federal rate mean?" She stated that the U.S. Department of
Defense (DoD) sets the federal per diem rate for Alaska, which
is the rate for a non-contiguous state. Alaska's legislative
per diem rate is currently the highest federal short-term per
diem rate. She referred to the information on the chart on
Slide 4, which lists the maximum lodging rate, meal rate, and
incidental rate for Juneau for two seasons. She indicated that
the rate changes seasonally: the total maximum per diem for the
summer is $295 and for the winter is $275. She pointed out that
the rate may also be adjusted by DoD according to a market
shift; for example, it was set at $213 earlier in the current
session and recently was changed to $275.
6:09:57 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX said that her understanding is that the
seasonal change is the beginning of March; however, the chart
shows May as the beginning of the seasonal change.
MS. WILBUR explained that the seasonal dates listed on the chart
indicate yearly changes for winter and summer. She suggested
that there are additional "de facto" adjustments made by DoD
based on local rates for lodging, meal, and living expenses.
6:11:09 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 5, entitled "Two Slide History of
SOCC & Leg Per Diem, Pt. 1," and asked, "Why does legislative
per diem work the way it does?" She mentioned that Slide 5
gives a short history on legislative per diem and how it relates
to the SOCC. She relayed that in 1986, the SOCC was authorized
and vested with full power to set legislative compensation
salaries, including per diem, but could only do so after a
constitutional amendment was approved. Until the constitutional
amendment was passed, statutory guidelines were adopted making
legislative per diem rates the same as those of [other] State of
Alaska (SOA) employees. These guidelines were to be repealed
once the constitutional amendment passed.
MS. WILBUR stated that by 1992, the constitutional amendment had
neither been passed nor offered to voters. She said that
applying the SOA per diem rates to legislators was intended to
be a short-term solution. She offered that doing so turned out
to be an accounting "nightmare": at that time, legislators
could receive per diem during both session and interim; there
was a short-term rate for legislators not living in their
permanent residences during session or while traveling to do
legislative business; there was a long-term rate for legislators
living in their permanent residences while doing legislative
business; and there was a variation on each rate based on where
a legislator lived.
MS. WILBUR related that a floor amendment [Amendment 2] to
Senate Bill 99, an omnibus licensing bill, was offered by the
chair of Legislative Council in 1993 [the Eighteenth Alaska
State Legislature, (1993-1994)]. The amendment withdrew the
authority to set travel reimbursement and per diem for
legislators from the SOCC and gave the authority to Legislative
Council.
MS. WILBUR relayed that from 1994 to 2017, Legislative Council
has had the authority to set legislative per diem; it has set
the per diem at the highest federal rate of per diem set by DoD
and based on the location at which a person is receiving per
diem.
6:14:28 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 6, entitled "Two Slide History of
SOCC & Leg Per Diem, Pt. 2," to discuss the history of the SOCC.
She said that Legislative Council withdrew the authority to set
per diem from the SOCC because the SOCC had not yet been
enacted. She relayed that in 2008, the SOCC was reestablished
as a fully functioning commission. Former Representative Mike
Doogan introduced House Bill [260] to repeal and replace the
defunct SOCC statutes and establish a new system, which would
(indisc.) the commission to set salaries for legislators, the
governor, the lieutenant governor, and department commissioners.
She stated that the intent of this legislation was to keep
legislators "at arm's length" from the process of having to set
their own compensation to avoid conflicts of interest, to
decrease inequity in the system of setting rates, and to avoid
having to adjust legislative salaries through legislation. She
added that it does not look good when legislators adjust their
own salaries by legislation, even when the adjustment is
necessary and consistent with market prices. She maintained
that the proposed legislation would require Legislative Council
to set per diem in accordance with the recommendation of the
SOCC.
MS. WILBUR relayed that the language in House Bill 260
pertaining to the SOCC was subsequently incorporated into House
Bill 417 by the House Finance Committee and passed both bodies
[as SCS CSHB 417(FIN)], establishing the SOCC as it is today.
Consequently, the SOCC sets salaries for legislators, the
governor and lieutenant governor, and department commissioners.
She said that currently the SOCC does not address legislative
per diem. She stated that in 2009, the SOCC recommended that
legislative salaries be increased from $24,000 to $50,400 per
year. It also eliminated interim per diem, which had allowed
legislators to claim per diem during interim if they had
performed up to four hours of work on any given day.
6:17:02 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if the SOCC ever recommended a
salary increase after 2009.
MS. WILBUR responded that the SOCC made recommendations for
salary increases for the governor and lieutenant governor in
2011, which the legislature adopted; in 2014, it recommended
salary increases for commissioners, which the legislature
rejected. She stated that in 2015, the SOCC recommended that if
a deputy commissioner was offered the position of commissioner
and his/her salary was currently greater than that of the
commissioner, he/she would not have to take a pay cut to become
commissioner.
6:18:54 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL referred to the idea of the SOCC setting the
compensation for legislators with the intent of keeping the
process "at arm's length" from legislators. He suggested that
if the SOCC's recommendation is subject to legislative approval,
then that brings the decision within arm's length. He gave an
example: the SOCC decides to recommend a legislative salary
increase of 25 percent, because the legislators have not had an
increase since 2009. He asked if it could be perceived that
there is an expectation for the legislature to act depending on
the political whim at the time.
MS. WILBUR responded that she will address that in a subsequent
slide.
6:20:14 PM
MS. WILBUR said that even though the SOCC had the legal
authority to set legislative per diem as far back as 2009, it
decided not to do so; it wanted Legislative Council to continue
to set travel allowances and legislative per diem.
6:20:40 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 7, entitled "Current legal
relationship," and explained that it describes the legal
relationship between the SOCC and per diem policy. She relayed
that AS 24.10.130(c) of Article 03, entitled "Compensation of
Legislators," states that the Alaska Legislative Council shall
adopt a policy in accordance with AS 39.23.540(d). She said
that AS 39.23.540(d) states that the SOCC shall set the rate and
form of compensation benefits and allowances for legislators.
6:21:21 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 8, entitled "State of the SOCC in
2007." She stated that the SOCC is a five-person board
appointed by the governor: the speaker of the House puts
forward two nominees; the president of the Senate puts forward
two nominees; and the governor chooses one nominee from each and
appoints three people from the public. The commissioners on the
board serve "staggered" four-year terms; they meet no more than
once per year and no less than once every two years. The
commissioners may not serve on any other state boards or
commissions or in any group for which the board makes
recommendations for at least four years before becoming an SOCC
commissioner. A legislator would have to wait four years after
his/her term ended before being eligible to serve on the SOCC.
MS. WILBUR mentioned that the duties of an SOCC commissioner are
to set salaries for the governor, the lieutenant governor,
legislators, and department commissioners. She clarified that
the legislature does not have the power to approve SOCC
recommendations but does have the power to reject them. The
legislature may refrain from acting, therefore adopting the
recommendations de facto, or it may pass legislation to reject
the recommendations. She explained that to reject SOCC
recommendations, legislators must pass a bill within the first
60 days of the session rejecting the recommendations. She added
that the SOCC puts forward a package of recommendations so that
to reject the recommendations, the legislature must reject them
"wholesale." She gave an example: the SOCC may not allow an
increase in the lieutenant governor's salary but reject an
increase in commissioners' salaries.
6:23:35 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL asked what determines SOCC's agenda for
making recommendations.
MS. WILBUR replied that it is written into statute that SOCC is
to assess if changes need to be made, and that assessment must
be performed at least once every two years and no more than
every year. The assessment entails a systematic analysis of a
variety of data to decide if compensation and salary rates are
appropriate and if recommendations are needed. The SOCC
considers rates of other states, past legislative salaries,
cost-of-living, inflation rates, and an abundance of salary
data.
6:25:04 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 9, entitled "SOCC Membership," to
point out the current and past members of the board.
6:25:32 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL referred to Slide 9 and asked for the
meaning of "Public/House of Representatives" after the first
name under current members.
MS. WILBUR explained that each member is a public member, whose
nomination comes from the House of Representatives, the Senate,
or the governor. She pointed out the one vacant seat shown in
the chart.
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS asked if that vacancy has been filled by
the governor.
MS. WILBUR replied that she believes that Scott Cunningham holds
that seat, although the name is not yet on the SOCC website.
6:26:40 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 10, entitled "What would it look
like if SOCC set per diem?" She mentioned that she spoke with
Jessica Geary [Accounting Finance Manager, Legislative
Administrative Services] of LAA, who indicated that she sees no
technical or logistic difficulties, under the current
legislative accounting system, with the SOCC setting per diem
rates. She stated that the SOCC already uses data-driven
methods to craft fair and logical proposals for legislative
salaries and could do the same regarding per diem.
MS. WILBUR pointed out that the SOCC is an apolitical and
impartial body specifically designed to remove legislators from
the awkward position of setting their own compensations and per
diems. Tasking the SOCC with that function supports that
intent. She said that with authority over both salary and per
diem, the SOCC can maintain a balance between cost-of-living,
which per diem is intended to cover, and salary, to make sure
that legislators' living expenses are covered and a diverse
range of good candidates are attracted to public office. She
added that since the SOCC meets a minimum of every other year
and a maximum of once per year, it can make necessary
adjustments or address unexpected changes without the need for
legislation. She suggested that consequently, legislative per
diem would cease to consume legislative time, money, and
resources.
6:28:23 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if her understanding is correct:
the SOCC has the authority to perform the tasks mentioned but
has not performed them.
MS. WILBUR replied that in statute, in the records of the
committee meetings to establish the SOCC, and in SOCC meeting
records, there is evidence to suggest that the SOCC has the
legal power to set per diem; however, Legislative Council has
been performing this task for the past nine years and the SOCC
has declined to contest that.
MS. WILBUR, in response to Representative LeDoux, said that HB
181 would require the SOCC to set per diem rates. She confirmed
that currently the SOCC has authority under statute to set per
diem rates; it is not using this authority; and HB 181 would
require them to use that authority to set per diem rates.
6:30:29 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 11 and stated that on the right of
the slide is a list of the reports that the SOCC consulted to
make 2015 salary recommendations - evidence of its data-driven
approach to setting salaries. She pointed out the statement on
the left of the slide indicating that the SOCC will meet to make
recommendations later this year; therefore, the proposed
legislation is timely.
6:31:05 PM
MS. WILBUR referred to Slide 12 to give thanks to those who
assisted her with her research.
6:31:41 PM
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK referred to Slide 6, which cites the
legislation proposed by Mike Doogan. He pointed out that the
slide indicates that the SOCC was to adjust legislative salaries
every five years. He asked if that was correct or if that was
eliminated from the bill.
MS. WILBUR explained that she inserted the language about having
to adjust salaries every five years to illustrate how difficult
it would be for the legislators to set their own salaries. She
added that to keep up with inflation and cost-of-living, they
would have to adjust the salaries often. She said that she
regrets using such specific information, since it was meant to
be representational and not factual.
6:33:01 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if the SOCC has given any reason why
it has not considered either a legislative salary increase, or a
legislative salary decrease within the last 13 years. She
suggested that it hasn't considered the legislature at all and
asked if there is an explanation for that.
MS. WILBUR answered that the SOCC considers the legislature, but
making recommendations is a different matter.
6:34:13 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL asked how many state legislatures determine
their own salary, and he offered his belief that the U.S.
Congress does vote on its own salary. He stated that he grew up
in a state in which lawmakers voted on their own salary and
still do.
MS. WILBUR referred to a list, entitled "2017 Legislative
Compensations By State," in the committee packet. She said that
she does not know the specific number but said she believes that
19 states have independent compensation commissions to set
legislative salaries.
6:35:51 PM
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH stated that in his experience, per diem is
usually based on reimbursable expenses, and he suggested the
SOCC might consider such a system of payment. He conceded that
paying a flat per diem rate is easier. He pointed out that many
of the legislative staff are from out of Juneau and do not
receive per diem. He asked, "How do you reconcile that?" He
mentioned that 12 out of 14 commissioners in the governor's
cabinet are domiciled outside of Juneau. He stated his
understanding that there are some housing accommodations for
these commissioners. He asked for an estimate of how many
legislative staffers are from out of town.
MS. WILBUR replied that she does not know and will defer that
question to Pamela Varni [Executive Director, LAA], who is
present in the audience.
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH responded that he would like to better
understand this issue and if the responsibility for
accommodating out-of-town staff lies with him or with the SOCC.
MS. WILBUR commented that legislative staff do not receive per
diem or compensation and there has been litigation in the past
concerning this. She said that SOA departmental employees
receive meals and incidentals as well as travel and lodging
reimbursements from the state if they are away from home to
work. She added that those rates are set by the commissioner of
the Department of Administration (DOA), and for these employees,
the policy for per diem and reimbursement is clearly stated in
the Alaska Administrative Manual (AAM). Legislative staff do
not receive per diem. Legislators do receive per diem, and the
policy for legislative per diem would be addressed in the
proposed legislation.
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH asked how per diem is calculated for SOA
employees. He asked if lodging is fully reimbursed and a meal
allowance is offered. He clarified that he is referring to
employees of departments, not legislative employees.
MS. WILBUR answered that per diem for state employees who travel
for work consists of lodging expenses, which are paid in
advance, a $60 meal allowance, and reimbursement of incidental
expenses. She said that the question is, Why can't legislators
just jump on the SOA rate? She explained that SOA employee
travel consists of a brief trip, and rates are set by the
commissioner of DOA and/or by collective bargaining units. She
added that none of these characteristics apply to legislators;
the nature of legislator travel - to move to Juneau for four
months - is very different from SOA employee travel. Applying
SOA per diem policy to legislators - that is, paying for travel
and lodging in advance - would be very difficult.
6:43:11 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL reiterated that when a state employee
travels for work - such as to visit a facility or check on a
dock - it involves a plane ticket, a few nights lodging, some
meals, and possibly a taxi. He said that legislators are in
Juneau for months and generally have different housing options
other than a nightly hotel. These alternative living
arrangements are typically less expensive than nightly hotel
expenses. He concluded that this "gray area" of compensation
would be addressed by the SOCC under the proposed legislation.
6:46:01 PM
KATE SHEEHAN, Director, Division of Personnel and Labor
Relations (DPLR), Department of Administration (DOA), stated
that under state statute, she serves as secretary to the SOCC.
In response to Representative LeDoux's question on salary
increase recommendations since 2009, she stated that there have
been recommendations, but not for the legislature. The SOCC
considers each person or group - the governor, the lieutenant
governor, the legislators, and the department commissioners -
then has a discussion and determines recommendations. It meets
several times, votes on the recommendations, issues a
preliminary report by November 15, and issues a final report to
the legislature ten days after the beginning of session.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX commented that it was curious that the
SOCC, which was authorized to deal with legislative salary
issues, has made no recommendations since it was formed in 2009.
MS. SHEEHAN responded that in the past four years, the SOCC has
only met twice and has determined for various reasons not to
make recommendations for wage increases.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if those reasons have been made
public.
MS. SHEEHAN responded yes. She stated that the meetings are
public and meeting minutes are posted on the SOCC website. She
stated that she has been in her position just under three years
so has been to only one SOCC meeting; the determination was made
at that meeting that there would be no recommendations for
salary increases due to budgetary issues.
6:48:56 PM
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS asked how the SOCC agenda is determined and
what method it uses to choose the categories of state officers
that it will consider for compensation.
MS. SHEEHAN answered that the SOCC considers each group - the
governor, the lieutenant governor, the commissioners, and the
legislators. There is data provided for each group, and there
is discussion on each group. She said that recommendations
might be no salary increases or some salary increases and not
others. She reiterated that the legislature may either take no
action, in which case the recommendations are adopted, or the
legislature may reject all the recommendations.
6:50:02 PM
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK commented that in 2009, there was a bill to
reject the SOCC recommendations. He asked if legislators paid
taxes on their interim per diem.
MS. SHEEHAN responded that she was not sure. She said that
there are not always taxes paid on per diem, but there
potentially could be taxes on per diem if it is above the
federal rate.
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK expressed his understanding that additional
compensation was awarded when a legislator left his/her normal
workplace to conduct legislative activity. He offered that
Juneau legislators get per diem because they also leave their
workplaces and forego other earnings; they receive 35 percent of
what is received by "traveling" legislators and are taxed. He
suggested that per diem is a part of compensation; it is part of
legislative salaries; and by statute it is determined by
Legislative Council.
6:52:22 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL responded that he has heard the explanation
that the per diem paid to Juneau legislators, which is 75
percent of the per diem paid to non-Juneau legislators, is
taxed, because they live in their own houses and eat in their
own kitchens. Their per diem is more like income and not
compensation for travel, lodging, and meals. He asked if the
SOCC considers per diem to be income, since the living expenses
for legislators vary greatly. He mentioned that the SOCC has
not recommended a cost-of-living increase in salary since its
inception, and he suggested it may consider an increase in per
diem to be a raise. He asked if that has been discussed by the
SOCC.
MS. SHEEHAN replied that the SOCC has not discussed legislative
per diem since 2009.
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL asked if the SOCC, as a compensation
commission, considers compensation in totality and if it
considers other sources of compensation, such as received by
Juneau legislators.
MS. SHEEHAN responded yes. She said that would be presented to
the SOCC for consideration along with office allowances and
travel.
6:54:38 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if it is fair to say that the SOCC
has not looked at anything with respect to the legislature since
2009.
MS. SHEEHAN replied that the SOCC looked at the historical wage
increases for the legislature and what legislators in other
states earn. She said that her recollection is that it did not
look at anything beyond that, but she added that she would have
to refer to the minutes.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX offered that the SOCC looked at the
salaries in other states and decided not to make any
recommendations.
MS. SHEEHAN answered that the SOCC considers the current budget
situation.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX noted the difference between a state
employee and a legislator regarding per diem expenses. She
asked if there was such a thing as long-term per diem for
employees in the executive branch and, if so, what that is.
MS. SHEEHAN answered that there is long-term per diem, and it
depends on the housing arrangement. She said that the executive
branch may need to send employees to oversee a project for an
extended time. In that case, the employees will be in an
apartment-type setting and will provide their own meals; meals,
incidentals, and lodging allowances are reduced. She said she
believed the meal and incidental allowance to be $30 per day.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if the state arranged the apartment
or lodging or if the employee was given an allowance to secure
his/her own lodging. She asked if there was a separate
allowance for food and incidentals.
MS. SHEEHAN relayed that the state does secure the housing and
pays for it. She said there are times when employees stay with
family or friends, in which case they get the very reduced rate
of $30, or they may own a home in the location. She conceded
that she did not know if, in some instances, the state paid a
set amount and the employee secured his/her own long-term
housing. She said she would provide that information to the
committee.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX mentioned that legislators bring their
cars to Juneau for the session and cannot rent a car in Juneau
for the three or four months that they are in Juneau. She asked
if the executive branch allows employees to rent cars for one to
four months while working at a different location or if they are
expected to ship their cars to the location.
MS. SHEEHAM responded that she did not know the answer to that
and would provide that information to the committee.
6:59:16 PM
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH stated that there are many staff that move
to Juneau for the session - they don't live in Juneau but are
there for work. He asked if the long-term per diem rate is
available or offered to them. He asked Ms. Sheehan if she had a
sense of how many staff were in that category and if there is
opportunity for them to mitigate some of the relocation costs.
MS. SHEEHAN stated that she does not work with legislative per
diems and salaries, and she deferred to Ms. Varni.
7:00:31 PM
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK referred to Slide 7. He relayed that AS
24.10.130(c) states that "the Alaska Legislative Council shall
adopt a policy in accordance with AS 39.23.540(d)", and
AS.39.23.540(d) states that "the commission shall make available
to the governor and presiding officers of each house of the
legislature a final report of its findings and recommendations".
He offered that the speaker and senate president receive these
reports annually in the first ten days of the legislative
session. He continued reciting AS 39.23.540(d), which read "its
findings and recommendations as to the rate and form of
compensation, benefits, and allowances" and declared that per
diem is an allowance. He stated that AS 24.10.130(c) refers to
"an applicable per diem allowance policy" and added that the
conditions of the policy should be established in accordance
with the statute. He suggested that the intent of the statute
is for the SOCC to meet, report its findings, and make
recommendations to the presiding officers of both bodies;
Legislative Council shall adopt a policy in accordance with the
duties of the SOCC. He stated that he did not understand why
that was not occurring as such and added that it appears the
SOCC has been "punting" by not making recommendations regarding
the legislature.
MS. SHEEHAN stated that she asked the former director [of DPLR]
why the SOCC does not consider legislative per diem. She said
the former director indicated to her that there may have been
some confusion in Section 24 regarding Legislative Council
setting the per diem policy, and an opinion was never obtained
from the Department of Law (DOL).
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK mentioned that the statute states that the
Alaska Legislative Council shall adopt a policy in accordance
with AS.39.23.540(d), which names the duties of the SOCC. He
expressed that a legal opinion may be warranted.
7:04:26 PM
PAM VARNI, Executive Director, Legislative Affairs Agency (LAA),
in response to Representative Birch, stated that about 100-120
legislative staff are reimbursed for transportation to and from
Juneau and [paid] per diem for travel time. She said that
legislative staff salaries have changed over the years; in the
beginning, only leadership staff were paid a salary and other
staff were paid daily. She indicated that due to the
disparities between the two groups, many years ago the
legislature instituted salaries for all staff in order that they
might receive retirement and health benefits. She mentioned
that it has been about five or six years that legislative staff
have been paid for travel to Juneau for session and said she
believed that before that salaries were set higher to compensate
for the cost of travel. She said that per diem for legislative
staff has been discussed; however, the legislature has not taken
steps to establish it.
MS. VARNI pointed out that in the January 10, 2009, report, the
SOCC set the annual salary for legislators at $50,400. The SOCC
also decided that session per diem, travel expenses, moving
allowances, and office expense accounts should not be considered
compensation. She added that the SOCC wanted Legislative
Council to set the amount and rules governing moving expenses
and per diem allowances and made those recommendations in its
report; therefore, the SOCC did not make any recommendations for
per diem.
MS. VARNI explained that the state [executive branch] pays a
short-term per diem rate of $60 for meals and a long-term per
diem rate of $33 for meals. She relayed that the state pays
"actuals" for short-term lodging or $30 for a noncommercial
lodging option. She continued by saying that the state paid a
long-term rate of $45 for commercial lodging and $30 for non-
commercial lodging. She mentioned that the executive branch
pays actuals [for lodging] according to the bargaining
agreements. She said that Ms. Geary informed the per diem
committee that if LAA switched to actuals, it would need another
accountant.
MS. VARNI expressed her opinion that the federal rate of per
diem has worked well for the legislature. She suggested that
whether it is the SOCC or DoD setting the rates, the rates will
go up and down. She mentioned that since 1995, the federal per
diem rate has decreased 19 times and has increased 23 times.
She gave the following example: The SOCC sets a rate of $213
per day and the federal rate is decreased to $175 per day. The
state is not to exceed the maximum federal rate and therefore
must tax legislators the difference between the two rates. Ms.
Varni maintained that would create a great deal of accounting by
the state to accomplish that. She reiterated that the system of
per diem used for legislators has worked well.
7:09:47 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX requested that Ms. Varni state the federal
long-term per diem rate and asked if that rate would "work as
well" from an accounting viewpoint.
MS. VARNI responded that currently the federal long-term rate
for Juneau is $206.25 per day. She opined that rate would work
well and mentioned that in 2014 the federal government
considered using a flat rate. She relayed that the short-term
rate is for 0 to 30 days, the long-term rate is for 30 to 180
days, and for over 180 days, there is another rate.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if the $206.25 rate is the long-term
rate for 30 to 180 days.
MS. VARNI responded, "That is correct."
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if using the federal long-term rate
would work for LAA from an accounting standpoint.
MS. VARNI answered that LAA would have no problem with using
that rate. It would pay legislators the short-term rate if
traveling for a short time and the long-term rate for session,
which would be 75 percent of the short-term rate.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if her understanding is correct:
when legislators leave Juneau to attend a conference, they
continue to get the short-term Juneau per diem rate; they get
reimbursed actuals for their hotel but no meal allowance.
MS. VARNI replied, "That is correct."
7:12:47 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL said that he has heard that legislative
staffers are paid at a higher range than someone in a comparable
position in another state agency. He asked if that is true.
MS. VARNI responded that she has not studied that recently; a
salary study could be performed to determine that. She
mentioned that staff duties are allocated differently in each
legislative office.
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL asked if, for example, a Range 15, Step C in
the legislature is different from a range 15c in another state
agency, or if they are uniform across the board.
MS. VARNI conceded that the two branches of government have
different salary schedules. She added that employees under the
legislative branch did not receive a cost-of-living (COLA)
increase, which was received by employees of the executive
branch. She mentioned that there are different bargaining
units, and she is unfamiliar with the difference in the salary
schedules among them.
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL said that he had heard that legislative
staff receive higher compensation due to varied work hours,
varied work days, and working away from their homes.
MS. SHEEHAN stated that range levels differ between the
executive branch and the legislative branch, which is exempt.
She relayed that the Classification Section [DPLR] in DOA
determines the salary ranges in the executive branch based on
statute; they are internally aligned so that like pay is awarded
for like work. The work of an office assistant is a range 8.
She said that an exempt agency may decide that the work of an
office assistant is Range 10 work; it can determine that the
work warrants a higher range. She concluded that differences in
salary between the two branches may be due to different salary
schedules, different assignments of salary levels for certain
work, or non-comparable positions between the two branches.
7:17:13 PM
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK stated that he recently learned that spouses
receive per diem for days of travel to and from Juneau. He
asked if that is correct.
MS. VARNI nodded affirmatively.
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK asked if under HB 181, the SOCC would
consider the different lifestyles of legislators or listen to
testimony from legislators regarding per diem. He mentioned
that some legislators can get by with very little and some move
their entire families to Juneau.
MS. SHEEHAN responded that the SOCC may consider anything it
chooses, and public testimony is taken at its meetings. She
expressed her belief there would be no restrictions against
legislators testifying.
MS. VARNI clarified that the spouse and family of a legislator
receive a reduced per diem for travel to Juneau, but not during
the session.
7:19:38 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL stated his understanding that the system
currently works fine in that there is a set salary that has not
been changed since 2009, but it is reviewed every year; the per
diem schedule that Legislative Council uses is based on the
federal rate. He asked Ms. Varni if she believes the system is
working well.
MS. VARNI replied yes. She stated that the choice is to
continue to pay the maximum federal per diem or look at the 75
percent. She added that is what other state legislatures do;
under the IRS regulations, legislators are eligible for the
federal per diem rate. This amount is to pay for lodging and
meals, and that is why Juneau legislators are taxed. She
mentioned that there are a few states that pay [per diem to]
their legislators living within 50 miles of the capitol, and she
stated that she is certain that these legislators, too, are
being taxed. She relayed that LAA previously taxed long-term
per diem, because legislators were receiving it in their home
towns. She added that the practice discontinued with the salary
increase. She related that she noticed on the SOCC website that
the Consumer Price Index (CPI) for the $50,400 has increased to
$56,000.
7:22:11 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL referred to the document citing compensation
by state and asked for the number of states in which the
legislature votes on compensation and the number of states in
which compensation is set by a commission.
MS. WILBUR replied that she would provide that information.
7:23:05 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX moved to adopt the proposed committee
substitute (CS) for HB 181, Version 30-LS0717\J, Gardner,
3/28/17, as the working document. There being no objection,
Version J was before the committee.
[HB 181 was held over.]
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| HB074 Letter of Opposition 3.21.17.pdf |
HSTA 3/28/2017 5:30:00 PM |
HB 74 |
| HB074 DMVA Letter 3.21.17.pdf |
HSTA 3/28/2017 5:30:00 PM |
HB 74 |
| HB190 Fiscal Note 3.27.17.pdf |
HSTA 3/28/2017 5:30:00 PM |
HB 190 |
| HB 190 Flow Chart Regulation Adoption Process.pdf |
HSTA 3/28/2017 5:30:00 PM |
HB 190 |
| HB 190 A Sponsor Statement 3.24.17.pdf |
HSTA 3/28/2017 5:30:00 PM |
HB 190 |
| HB0190A.PDF |
HSTA 3/28/2017 5:30:00 PM |
HB 190 |
| HB181 Draft Proposed CS ver J 3.28.17.pdf |
HSTA 3/28/2017 5:30:00 PM |
HB 181 |